• Changing up the way we look at numbers
• Pricing yourself as a startup
• Strategic approach to having people within your business
• Resources and tips for starting out

Welcome to Take Control with Nicole, as business owners we experience first hand the fine line between our personal and business lives. During our conversations, we will look at simple hints and tips to create time, reduce overwhelm, and help you to navigate through your journey to where you want to be. If you’re looking for smarter ways to work, and create space and time freedom in your day, then you’re in the right place. All right, let’s go.

Nicole Smith
Hello, and welcome back to Take Control with Nicole. Today I’m speaking with a fabulous Natalie Kidcaff all about the importance of pricing in your business. Natalie is a strategic accountant with a personality. Yes, they do exist who helps business owners link their business strategy with their financial so that they can see sustainable growth with numbers to back it. Natalie is dedicated to helping business owners stop stressing about how it all works financially, and start focusing on what matters to make their vision a reality. With over 15 years of experience across all levels of Business Strategy and Financial Information, she applies proven concepts to support her clients in reaching success in a quicker and more formulated way, the thrill of helping small business owners to understand the bigger picture, breaking it down into simply bite sized actionable components. Now that sounds like something I’ll enjoy. And then applying these learnings to their business decisions is what Natalie loves most about her work. And finally, the feeling of pure joy. Creating those aha moments for you is why she serves her businesses like your ones that are listening right now. Whether you’re starting or growing your business, Natalie is there to help you create solid financial frameworks to reach your highest potential, gain the confidence to know how to make the right decisions in your business at the right time.

Well, hello, welcome. I’m so excited to have you on here. Finances is one of those things, funnily enough, that is a focus of mine at the moment. And I always say these conversations come at the perfect time for me. And for the listeners. But welcome. I’m so excited to chat all about pricing and finance and hear a bit about you.

Natalie Kidcaff
Thanks, Nicole, I’m so so excited to hear that you’ve jumped into your finances. It’s not an easy thing to do for most business owners, and especially in the creative area but good on you.

Nicole Smith
It is just an add on. You know, I think it’s one of those things that when you start a business, you know that money stuff’s important, right? We need to know that the cash flow is happening so we can pay the people in the we get paid and finding that kind of happy moment in to price. So yeah, it’s so it’s so great to have people like you to actually support humans in the business world to find what that means for them.

Natalie Kidcaff
Yeah, I love it. It’s something that comes very natural to me. And I know that it doesn’t for a lot of business owners, sorry, I really am trying to help everyone out as much as I can.

Nicole Smith
So first, let’s jump in and chat a little bit about you about your background, what you do, where you’ve come from, why did you start your business? All the things?

Natalie Kidcaff
Yeah, sounds good. So I started out my accounting career, in working in boutique tax firms, essentially my role, there was my last role, specifically helping new business owners who’d purchase like motels and management rights. So it was really interesting, you know, helping them and being a go through person to start their business, they mainly come from an employee background, and this was their first time. So yeah, it was really good experience for me to get a real understanding of like, what they were going through and how come they were going through it. And essentially, I’ve built this passion for helping small businesses from their, which was really good. The best part is that I found out I guess, around foundations and structure and financial management and what can drive things the wrong direction as well. So focusing really on those key points of how to make a business run successfully, as well as grow and scale effectively without trying to, you know, navigate too much of the difficult situations where possible.

Nicole Smith
Because there’s a lot going on when you first start a business, especially if you’ve just come from the employment, you know, the other side of the business world being an employee versus the employer and the finance stuff. As I mentioned before it’s you get I think you get excited about all the the real quick wins, right? The getting your social media up and running or you know, getting your first client all those things and then all of a sudden you come to a point you’re like, I need to actually really need to understand the numbers a bit more than just pie in the sky like, Oh, that feels good.

Natalie Kidcaff
And and I call that the fun stuff. So getting into all the fun stuff and then leaving the to lose. The hard to do is to last. So I mean, I built, I guess my career off the back of loving working with people and really just using I guess my training and that kind of skill set to really focus on whether it be internally in a business or externally with a small business owner now is just really helping people learn and dive into taking things by the horns of it. Just, if you if you learn it now the foundations, you’ll you’ll have them forever. And I think that’s something you’ll learn during your finances is like, well, actually, once you get it sorted, you kind of get this stress taken off your shoulders. And basically, you can just really run your business and come back to that and go, Okay, well, what was my plan? What was my strategy? How do those linked together? But are the numbers creating and showing me what I’m trying to achieve? And what do we need to do, I guess, essentially, to tweak things to make it work better, or even just making just particular decisions. So I like to say things like, Well, can I put my staff member on? Or does my pricing need to increase? Or do I need to go to my suppliers and double check why, you know, they’re charging me so much, and whether I can get a discount if I do more volume, and that can grow your business. So there’s so many things that having your foundations and your plan and your strategy in place really help you to make decisions overall.

Nicole Smith
It’s all data, right? You know, like the numbers, I love better data. And the numbers don’t lie, like numbers and numbers you can’t like, unless you’re very creative with your accounting, you know. But ultimately, you’re in your systems, if even if it’s an Excel spreadsheet, you’ve got your invoices coming in, you’ve got your invoices coming or payments in payments out, you know, and understanding all of that, and where you’re headed. It’s you can make really educated decisions when you know the diet, right?

Natalie Kidcaff
Yeah, exactly. And that’s what I’m all about. I just, I like to lay it out. So they can do that.

Nicole Smith
Yeah, I’ve noticed with working with my clients, and just in my past oil, you know, I was responsible for that reconciliation piece, you know, of the things coming in and out and making sure they’re all coded and accounts accounted for. And we understand what it is we’re actually doing over here, when the process to do that part of it is really beautiful and easy. It is easy. Basically, there’s no other word for it. We I enjoy it. I guess I’m maybe a little bit of a nerd in that regards. I love to see things balancing up. But I know when I don’t have that process in place. So when I started my new my business hadn’t quite got that right for me. And it felt icky. It felt hard until I’d really nailed it. Do you find that with a lot of newpeople?

Natalie Kidcaff
Yes, yeah, I think I think you’ve just summed it up in a perfect way is, once you’ve got that process, right, which I know you’re all about, and I love that you guys, you know, focus on processes and SOPs, and you know, just really nailing things. It is all about that once you’ve got the process, right that the basics are there, it’s then just about figuring out how to utilise the information totally. But the icky feeling is probably a real phenomenon. Like a lot of people I’ve found I’ve done a lot of surveys and stuff because I’ve been working on you know, building things out in the last 12 months. And I found out that it’s everyone’s so afraid of these numbers and, and what they might tell them but what they need to do is get excited about them.

Nicole Smith
I was actually chatting with my business besties yesterday, and we were talking about finance and the mindset around it and how when you’re reading the balance sheet, it’s red or black. And that kind of like you know, that feeling of oh, it’s so stuck. It’s hard It feels not yet so I’ve decided that we’re going to change the colours. And it’s gonna be like rose gold and like pink glitter. And that way it doesn’t matter.

Natalie Kidcaff
No, I love this.

Nicole Smith
It’s all about how we connect with it right? And we know that in business especially in those early times maybe the money stuff isn’t as free flowing as we’d like it to be and we know it’s going to be and being able to understand why and what we can put into place to help us find those clients and welcoming that money as well.

Natalie Kidcaff
Yeah, totally. On the same page i It’s so exciting to talk to someone who’s got that background as well of all this all these paces and has driven it forwards in your own business. Specifically because It all just comes together with what you’re doing as well.

Nicole Smith
Absolutely, you know, we’ve got to make these things easy and easy for everyone is slightly different, right? And if easy is outsourcing it, and you can look at the numbers, and you can see that that’s the thing. outsource it.

Natalie Kidcaff
Yeah, totally. And then just make sure that you’re getting the business advisor or the overlay, and they’re explaining it to you in terms that makes sense to you. And don’t be afraid to say to them, that doesn’t make sense. Please explain.

Nicole Smith
What is this kind and why are there things in there? And what are we doing? Why? Or I want to see more detail, that’s something that we’ve recently done, you know, in my Xero file is actually split it out per service. And then my management accountants, like, we also want to see really how much is going to each project as well. So for my bigger clients, I have my Nicole 2.0. Literally, my my second in charge is called Nicole as well. So what is her expenses? And What time am I spending on it so we can make those educated decisions? Am I pricing this service at the right price for the output that I’m actually doing?

Natalie Kidcaff
So yeah, so important, I think we usually have this data and this information, whether it be easy or difficult initially, to get a hold of it. But once you start drilling down, I find that it’s really important in your business model and moving forwards because say you’ve got a client who is working, you’re working a lot with and it’s taking a lot more time than you expected, it’s actually potentially making your loss. And that to me is something you really need to consider whether you want to continue with that particular client, or whether you can possibly go and you know, get someone who’s more aligned with what you can deliver with them. And it’s all part and parcel. It’s the same with products specifically, like I work with them. I alongside that and say, Well, hold on if that product isn’t good product, let’s get it off the product list. Like it, let’s not let your business take that hit, I guess.

Nicole Smith
Isn’t that that kind of all, but we’ve always done it that way. So I will just leave it. It’s that mentality, isn’t it? It’s like, oh, but you know, it’s fine. But is it fine?

Natalie Kidcaff
Yeah, not really.

Nicole Smith
I know when I first started moving from the employee world, and looking at that hourly rate, and then transitioning that over into my business hourly rate, which I’ve moved away from hourly rates as well now, so we can have that conversation. But that initial step was really scary. Because, you know, I looked at that number, like there is no way, there’s no way people are gonna pay that. No, no way. And sure enough, I got my first client and my hourly rates gone up a lot since then. But that initial like, moment, how do you how do you support your clients through discovering what is the best sort of pricing to start with in their business?

Natalie Kidcaff
Yeah, it is a really difficult one. A lot of consulting businesses work towards a formula initially, just to make sure you’re, I guess, transitioning and being able to earn enough money to cover what they say salary of what you previously had. However, I like to start, I guess, considering things differently with most of my clients in the sense that I go, Okay, but what value are we actually adding here. And I know that it’s just an hourly rate. However, what about all the years and years of experience that you’ve got, that doesn’t come for free. So you’ve learned, you know, the things you need to know, you’ve also gotten to the point where you go out and do additional learning, and that cost you money and all of these things. It’s not just about the costs, but it’s also about what you’re bringing to the table. So for yourself, like your broad experience, across all the things that you’re doing to help a business, not everyone can come up with that kind of package. The other thing that’s recently come to my attention is that you’re managing yourself. So if you’re an employee, and they’ve they can have an employee in marketing or consulting or whatever, you know, whatever they’re doing in their business, they have to manage that person. But if you’re if you’re outsourced, and and you’re looking after yourself and doing everything, as well as managing upwards and delivering on time, well, what is that worth? I think that’s really important, too. And then the other part I consider not just in the services industry, but also products as well is what’s the emotional value here? It’s a currency essentially, that it’s difficult to refine or define in your situation as well as what am I actually worth here because I’m changing their whole life. I’m changing what they’re scared of. I’m changing potentially, how they’re doing things and then I’m saving them all this time. So there’s just so many different parts that you can go through, and it depends on the industry, I guess, but ultimately, we kind of worked through those things.

Nicole Smith
Yeah, and it’s so good to have an advisor in those early days because it that value piece, it took me a while to go, oh, hang on, what we’re doing together here is a moment in time for our transaction. But it’s a transition for that business, that’s going to be far greater than where we are now in the way of the team working more efficiently, they’re able to do go into the new areas, they want to because they feel supported, because they know their operations are really, you know, humming away in the background, understanding that it is a value value transaction, you know, as much as you’re getting, obviously, whatever you’re getting from your side, your clients getting just as much or more that they can take away going for, you know, for long term. So, it’s so good to have someone like you to be like, you know, this, this, this is what we’re doing.

Natalie Kidcaff
Yeah, yeah. And you just hit the nail on the head, again, it’s the opportunities that you’re creating for them. So whether they can land a bigger client, or, you know, they could sell more products, or whatever the case is, you’re creating this opportunity. And that is, it’s almost like the MasterCard ad.

Nicole Smith
And I think you know, you do once you step into that space, and you can really connect with that value, it does make decision making a lot easier. And I know, I’m constantly evolving and learning and iterating in my business space. But I know now I’m very aware of when things are not feeling right, in a service that I’m offering, for instance, and I’m able to step back, have a review of what’s happening. Is the offering right still is the price, right? Am I attracting the right people or at humans for my clients? What do we need to do to make it a thing? Is it going to stay? Or are we going to get rid of that so we can focus on something else, I’ve just done a big deal, not a big shift, probably about two months ago. And the result of it is I’m actually now really attracting the clients that I want to be working with in that sort of one to one capacity. So there’s those other outcomes that come when you really do connect with the pricing structure.

Natalie Kidcaff
Yeah, totally. And I love that I am all about what you just explained. I did the same thing with my business just recently. And it’s just amazing feeling you start to really value yourself even more. So. Yeah, it’s good.

Nicole Smith
Yeah. Let’s talk about I guess the connection of the right client, we save that’s the right word, the perfect ideal client, and pricing. Because I know again, from my experience, when I was at a lower price point, that was attracting people that needed a lot more investment of time and energy. Whereas when we went higher, and now attracting the people that a little bit different, feels a little bit different. There’s that autonomy, full trust that comes with that level of client as well. Do you find that?

Natalie Kidcaff
Yeah, absolutely. Like, I think it’s a mindset thing in the first instance, but then when you start to actually see it play out, you do those little happy dances and you’re like, you know what, this is real.

Nicole Smith
It’s so funny you say that, I must have been locked down and I did a little, when reels first started being a thing, and Charlotte, my daughter, and I, like literally did a happy dance when we got a new client. I say, we, when I’ve got a new client, but it’s so exciting, isn’t it? Keep going. I totally cut you off.

Natalie Kidcaff
No, that’s perfect. All right, that’s perfect. I think that’s in a nutshell, really, like when you have those little wins. And the excitements there. And you’re like, No, I’ve made the right decision. And usually that’s like, how you start stepping forwards is that you’re, you know, you’re getting supported by the universe or whatever you want to call it to be in the right place at the right time. And it’s just happening, it’s just moving. And if your mindset is right on your pricing, that will all play out as well, which means that you’re valuing yourself correctly, you’re in the right place at the right time, and you’re collecting and gathering the right people you want to work with and creating value for them.

Nicole Smith
Yeah. And I think coming back right down to the foundations as well is when I started my business, I knew that I didn’t want to be doing all the doing and done all the doing my whole career. And I was I’m stepping up into the space that I am in now that sort of higher strategy design area, which is what I call what I do. So I knew from the get go two and a half years ago that I would have people in my umbrella that would help to execute my designs. It took me probably two years to really find that sort of strength to go Okay, it’s time now to Bring the builder in. I’d had vas, I’ve obviously got my fabulous Podcast Producer, who will have edited this episode that you’re listening to in your ears right now. So I’d surrounded myself in that realm. But taking the step that I needed to do, and I’d always known I wanted to do to find that Nicole, as I said, mentioned Nicole to be executing the designs, it’s also allowed me to welcome in more clients at that level, as well. And why I’ve been able to do that is because of the pricing of it.

Natalie Kidcaff
Yeah, wow, that’s totally on the on the money there.

Nicole Smith
Hello, there, I’m just interrupting this episode, as I would love to invite you to come on in and join us inside the members lounge, my community have shared with me that they joined initially, because they really wanted to discover the power of ClickUp, they wanted to be able to design, build, and connect their ClickUps within their own individual businesses. However, once they were inside, they really discovered how the power of looking at the foundations of your operational areas of your business, and designing those really to set you up for success is such a powerful element. And guess what else, we have a fabulous community inside. So once you’re in, you’re never gonna want to leave. So come on over, have a look, go to my website, theartisans.com.au and pop up to the Members Lounge button at the top. And we look forward to supporting you as you discover how fabulous it is when you’re confidently striding down easy street, see you inside the lounge.

Natalie Kidcaff
I just love seeing and hearing that coming from you. That’s perfect. That strategy piece isn’t always easy to get to. But when you get there, you’re absolutely in the right place at the right time. I’ve think I’ve read a book that mentions going from technician to manager. And essentially, that’s what you’ve got to do. But sometimes in the early stages your business, you do just have to do the doing get it right nailer. And then you can pass it on to someone as well, like, I know, you talk about SOPs and doing things the one way, same way in your business and that kind of thing, you know, you know, you’ve moved forwards, and you can really make a shift if you’re able to bring on those people to support you. And that you can’t do that without having your pricing right or being valued by the customer. And then knowing that you’re working with the team as well, so that you’re not always the go to person so that you can be with your other clients. So that’s great.

Nicole Smith
That is a big shift as well, isn’t it when I’m you know, I’ve got some other some colleagues that have service based businesses, and they are the face of the business. So when new clients come on board, they want to work with face of business, right, but she has a team. And so you know, I guess that’s a little bit about messaging and things as well. But being able to set your structure up however you want. So I talked about building big, but building big doesn’t necessarily mean big in humans or big in, you know, hours of work or big in whatever it’s however it feels right for you. And if you’re a person that’s a solopreneur and wants to stay that way fabulous. Having those strategies in place, though, can still really support you to make those decisions, too. If you ever do arrive at a point that you want to outsource something or, you know, just go up to you your money goals, that you’ve got that sort of plan in place.

Natalie Kidcaff
Yeah, totally. And then just being able to link them back to your financials and your money. And knowing that you can do it. That’s one of the best things about having a bit of a business plan and financial plan is going okay, well, once I hit target X, and I know I can hire someone to be able to do that. And that’s just part and parcel with getting these foundations right and being able to make decisions from them.

Nicole Smith
Yeah, exactly. So I hear that you have recently launched a shop with some resources and some templates and things like that. That’s something you could share with us.

Natalie Kidcaff
Yeah, sure. It’s very exciting. It’s been a long time in the making. Yeah, just recently launched it. So I guess over so many years of working with business owners. I noticed there was like a consistent theme of just that. How do I even start, where do I start? What do I do? What do I look at, especially around those financial areas of the business, which like you said, it’s the last thing we look at last thing we do, but it should potentially be the first thing we do. So

Nicole Smith
not the sexiest thing, right? It’s like with what I do. They’re like, Oh, yeah, we will the business is doing great. And we don’t need that. But then they all of a sudden, they’re like we need it. I’m like yeah, you do.

Natalie Kidcaff
I play and that’s the words I use numbers are not sexy. But if you get excited about them, and you can understand them, then we can really make your life sexy.

Nicole Smith
That’s right. It’s the flow and effect. Yeah.

Natalie Kidcaff
Totally yes, I just created some templates from, you know, all the years of experience that I’ve had, working in big businesses and what they focus on and making sure you’re covering your costs and things like that. And then also factoring your strategy and your growth into those templates. So all well, if my costs are this will, what do I need to do to cover them a so that’s my breakeven point, for example? Or how do I really scale and really make some money? Yeah, so you know, I’ve thrown together a bit of a Excel template, which can be used in Google Sheets as well, I guess.

Nicole Smith
I Excel. It’s one of my little joys I love going into Excel and building all the fun things and the formulas and the PR when I show people pivot tables, oh, my goodness, if you don’t know what a pivot table is, and you’re not geeking out, well, just if you want to geek out, come and chat with me.

Natalie Kidcaff
Once we get off here, I’ll let’s let’s just dive into a geek, because I love that stuff. Like, I run a lot of my business, I live with my businesses on Excel. And it’s just, it’s just a great place to figure things out, you know, so I’ve tried to build it for people so that they don’t have to think about that hard stuff, they just have to chuck in the numbers and plug and play I call it so yeah, and I made it really pretty colours. So it’s not black and red.

Nicole Smith
Rose gold and pink glitter for the win, let’s do it. Oh, you just nailed it on the head. Now with saying that, you know, I’ve been talking recently with them, the fabulous Serena Lowe talking about that white space, like white space for thinking is fabulous. But sometimes when you’re trying to take action, and you have too much white space, it’s like you’re not quite sure where to start. So if you don’t, you just leave it. Whereas if you have a template, like what you’ve designed there, at least the humans could open it up and be like, Okay, I can see I need to put these numbers here. And then this happens this way. And this is why I’m doing it. And all of a sudden, you’ve got that walking guide through that, like you’re sitting right next to them, right, you can play and then the numbers start to appear, and you get more confident with them. And yeah, it’s exciting.

Natalie Kidcaff
Yeah, and that’s really why I created it is to really support people in that startup phase that just save something, you know, somewhere to start. So you know, it does help them just to dive in and use it, I created a bit of a how to video alongside each of them as well. So that, you know, I know people are visually you know, a bit more focused on that. And you can really see kind of where I go and what I do so that you can follow it a bit. And, you know, it’s hopefully takes the scariness out of it.

Nicole Smith
So good. Yeah, whenever we’re writing procedures or creating like I’ve got create templates as well for for click up, they will be on sale at some point. So just hold hold everyone, he’ll well have a store. So watch this space. The words I’m looking for absolutely videos, because as much as everybody has a different have as has a different learning style. And so text is fabulous, but adding that different element in there. So this is for if you’re designing your own SOPs and your own business, think about the different ways that you can can do that. And I don’t know if you use loom. Yes, yes. So good luck raising, especially you know, when you do have a team, so I use it quite a lot. When I’m delegating my design work to Nicole, I’ll do a loom and I’ll be like, Okay, this is what I’m thinking, this is what I want to do. This is the space we’re going in. And it’s a really easy way to connect those things together. So yeah, looms amazing.

Natalie Kidcaff
I’ve just started using it with my one on one clients similar. Sorry, though. Yeah, if I do build a custom work paper or workbook for them, I run through how to use it. And I just love it.

Nicole Smith
Yeah, great for client updates. And yeah, actually, funnily enough, I did one yesterday. Like, okay, this is where we are. This is why we’re doing this. Are you happy for me to do that? Like that real just easy. You’re having a conversation? Just nice and easy? Ah, amazing. Well, do you have any really like I’m starting a new business, I don’t know where to go. I don’t know. Finances are sort of like they’re important. But you know, I’m not really good at that. Like, give me pointers for that new business owner to come in and say this is what you should have a look at without them massive outgoing of cash.

Natalie Kidcaff
Yeah, I guess. I always say to try and educate you myself as best as possible. So what that can look like is most of the government websites across all the different states. So the Victorian Business websites, excellent, that actually written some really good stuff. And it’s a bit easier to read, the Queensland Government’s got a lot of resources as well. So I say to try and like learn from the best, if possible. And get out there and just get your head around things a little bit as much as you can, I think that teaching yourself is, is when you’ve got a lot more time at the start of your business is probably the best place to start working towards there. So research and then reaching out to people or experts in your community. So if you are you, like I said, have a bit more time and things like that. I’ve just recently joined chi mentors, and I’m loving it, being able to just reach out to somebody who’s an expert in that field and have a chart, and then start to create a community around you to support yourself. So they’re probably the key things to do without a huge investment. But essentially, that’s why I created my templates to is having a one on one person, a consultant does tend to get more expensive. So it’s it is getting out there and seeing what’s available for a smaller cost and training yourself as best as you can, I guess.

Nicole Smith
Yeah, community is a big part of business. And I know for me, it’s been a big part of my journey, I was heavily involved in she mentors right at the start there. And they were a big integral part of you know, the initial stages of my business, and making those connections that I still connected with today. You know, I mentioned, I’m working with, you know, my management accountant who I met in that community. So, you know, it’s really fabulous to having you know, being in a virtual space or being in a room, you just never know who you’re going to meet. And the other thing is that there are so many fabulous business owners out there that you’ll find the right human that’s going to support you in the way that you need to be supported as well, when you get to that stage. And a lot of people offer the sort of one hour, you know, 90 minute come in have a chat, you know, for a few $100. You know, like for that type of to really get your process set up in that specific area. I think that’s an invaluable thing to invest in as well.

Natalie Kidcaff
Yeah, there are some really good initiatives that people are doing like that, and like, they call it like a discovery. And essentially, I think you’re right, it gives you some invaluable direction at bare minimum, you know, or guidance is saying, well, at least now I’ve got a bit of an idea of where I need to head.

Nicole Smith
Yeah, yeah, absolutely. Is there anything else you want to share with us about pricing, finance, all the things before we wrap up and go into our three questions?

Natalie Kidcaff
I think just back yourself. That’s one of the things I’ve been having this conversation with a lot of people I work with over the past, you know, few months specifically. And I do find some, there is a bit of a leniency towards women being this way, but we just don’t back ourselves enough to value or create a price that is the most appropriate for our business sometimes. And I think we just forget what we’ve got and who we are and what we’re actually giving to the these customers or clients of ours. So yeah, probably just really work through the numbers, but really back yourself and, and remind yourself that you’re good at what you do. And you’re in this place for a reason. So you’ve got a red hot shot.

Nicole Smith
I love it. And the more that you work with your clients and your community, you I think you become more aware of that. Like, I know, I still get surprised when I’ll say something and people were like, I didn’t know that was a thing. And for me, it’s just like, oh, yeah, every day, like you forget the knowledge that you acquire over the years of, you know, especially if you’ve been in the corporate world, and you’ve been involved in those structures, and they’re very structured over that of space and coming into your you know, the SME space, there’s a lot of different knowledge and especially if you’re curious and inquisitive and you’re a natural learner, you pick things up that you don’t even realise other people are not aware of.

Natalie Kidcaff
Yeah, totally. Totally.

Nicole Smith
Fabulous. Well, thank you so much. Let’s jump into our three questions. Are you ready?

Natalie Kidcaff
I’m ready.

Nicole Smith
Okay, what is your go to app that creates ease in your day?

Natalie Kidcaff
Well, being a numbers person, I could easily say Xero but I’m going to say Canva. I love absolutely love Canva it’s so easy to use and it makes all my proposals look so professional.

Nicole Smith
So good. I love Canva I think that’s first for small business. If you’re listening to this and you haven’t heard about Canva before go and google Canva it’s honestly go to In my business as well, it’s so fabulous. And the corporate space is still not aware of it, which is amazing, isn’t it? It’s like such a fabulous easy tool for people to access. So yeah, I love Canva.

Natalie Kidcaff
Yeah. And there’s, it also gives you a really great starting point, sometimes just if you’re trying to do an infographic or do a social media post, sometimes it just gives you that spark. And you’re like, Oh, I’ve got an idea. So it is good. Yeah.

Nicole Smith
Can we just pause the questions and come back to Xero for a minute? Yeah, that was actually one of the first decisions that I made in my business to implement Xero, because I knew that when I had a system like that, that would manage my invoicing and manage the flow of incoming and outgoing money that I could feel a little bit more confident to, to understand the numbers. What do you what’s your thoughts on that? Like, when you first start your business? How important is it to bring in a system like that straightaway?

Natalie Kidcaff
I think there’s a lot of different opinions of this in the pocket. But I am 100% onboard with Xero from day one. It’s it is an expense, I get that that people don’t see, they might need but I’ve been in the accounting industry a long time, I’ve been working with zero since it came to Australia. So I’ve been working to Xero for over 10 years now. I absolutely love it. It’s so in an intuitive for people who are non accountant, non bookkeepers, the business owner, and that was why it was built. But basically, I think it’s worth the money you spend on it. The reason I say that is because the data is so easy to access, report on and also give you clear, clear information to make decisions. Whereas if you’re using like Excel and stuff, it works, I’ve I can build you every day of the week, a cash book, what I would call a cash book, which I did for all my clients in startup base back in the day, but it takes a lot longer to get it right and make sure it’s correct. And also be able to use that unless you’re a super Excel user, like yourself. Use that data, you know, in an easy, functional way.

Nicole Smith
Yeah, I would I agree with that, especially if your business strategy and your financial strategy is to scale is to grow, you know, and we don’t start business for, for fun, what we do start for fun, but, you know, many of us that will be listening here or you know, have big grand plans of what they want their business to be right. And so if that is the way you’re heading, being able to, again, set that foundations up at the start means that you’re going to get those processes in place early, before you have the influx of work coming in. So you can get really comfortable with managing that. So that when it does get to that, you know, scalable stage and that messy middle, that you’re confident with it that you can continue on through. And then again, if you make the decision to outsource to a bookkeeper or whatever, you know, the processes and how to use the numbers in it.

Natalie Kidcaff
Yeah, yeah. And then I’ll throw in another line, which I know you’ll love. But that apps that back into the back of Xero and can connect with Xero provide you with an open ended way to run your business, business management through payments to, you know, everything you possibly would need systems and things like that. It’s just invaluable to be able to have that connection and be able to use it for the rest of your business and really scale up.

Nicole Smith
Yeah, one of my favourites that I have. I have a little zap that goes well. It’s actually yeah, it didn’t make which used to be Integromat. But anyway, connect up I digress. Literally when I pop a tag in my CRM and click off it sends all the details into Xero creates the client already there. So I just pop in and do the reoccurring invoices which if you haven’t heard of reoccurring invoices, go and investigate that because that is a lifesaver. Let’s remember to send the invoices out but that even in itself, it may seem like not much but it saves so much energy and time I don’t have to think about typing the things out any more. I just go and create the invoice and off it goes.

Natalie Kidcaff
Massive time saver. Like I just loved that you’ve created you’ve just created a whole coffee day for yourself during your week.

Nicole Smith
Love it. Absolutely love it. Awesome. Sorry. I just had to that was the thing. My ear worm that was before that I forgotten. Thank you for allowing that to happen. Okay, let’s get back on to our questions. Are you an online, paper or hybrid to do lists lover?

Natalie Kidcaff
Yes, I’m mixed. I’m definitely mixed. So I use a bit of Trello in in my time with my clients and some of my project work. So that’s my Online, even online email, all right myself at nighttime an email to do list. And then sometimes though, when I come in in the morning, and I haven’t been efficient the day before, and I just need to focus and work on today, I’ll get out my pen and paper. And I’ll cross them off.

Nicole Smith
Yeah, I love it. So, yes, very, very lots of hybrids out there. I love it. I’ve actually got a bit of a notebook. My daughter, funnily enough, got it in, she won a raffle prize that kinder, and she got this notebook. It’s just blank pages with a ring binder at the top. And I had that sitting on the left of me all the time now. And it’s just really good for those notes and those little moments to note down. So I’m hybrid to even though I love. Final question, what would you do if you created more space in your world?

Natalie Kidcaff
Yeah, this one’s a bit close to my heart. So I currently just donate to the Children’s Hospital Foundation. But I would love to have more time to go and be an entertainment volunteer. They call them. Yeah, yeah. And you go in and you play games with the kids and the families and help keep them entertained while they’re in hospital. And I just yeah, it’s been on my bucket list of things to do for a while. I just need to create that space.

Nicole Smith
Yep. That’s fabulous. Something about volunteering and giving a time isn’t a really lovely feeling.

Natalie Kidcaff
Yeah, I love it too.

Nicole Smith
Amazing. Well, thank you so much for the chat today. It’s been so fabulous to connect and talk about all the things I would love you to share where our listeners can connect with you. Where are you hanging out? And what’s your website? And all the things? What’s your shop, where’s your shop for that?

Natalie Kidcaff
Yeah, so all things social eyes, mainly hang out on Instagram @beyond_CFO. And you’ll also find me on LinkedIn and Facebook, they’re, my website is probably the best go to place to find more about me and all the things that I do, and how I can help small businesses. So I love just helping out my clients, the shop is also on my website, and in two places under shop. And you’ll also find it under the DIY Resources page there. Awesome, fabulous,

Nicole Smith
We are going to put all of those links in the show notes, as always. And if you are right at those early stages, or wherever you are in your journey, and you’re looking for that little bit of support to get you started, go and visit the shop and have a look at some of those fabulous Excel documents that are colourful and not red and black.

Natalie Kidcaff
Yeah, I will also throw in in there a coupon code for all the listeners, and they’ll get $20 off their templates. So I’ll get you to throw that into the show notes. But it’ll just be on the your the rotations. So that’ll be easy.

Nicole Smith
Fabulous. Thank you so much. That’s great. We’ll make sure we put that all in the show notes as well. So pop on over connect, check it all out. And again, finally, thank you so much for our conversation today. Natalie, it’s been wonderful.

Natalie Kidcaff
Yes. It’s been wonderful chatting to you to Nicole and loving listening to everything you’re doing. So it’s great to be in the community. And as part of the lead scale up and let’s improve our businesses party, I say.

Nicole Smith
That’s a pretty fun party to be at, I think bring the cocktails out. Let’s celebrate.

Natalie Kidcaff
Make it happen. Let’s make it happen.

Nicole Smith
Take an action. That’s what I say. Let’s take some action.

Natalie Kidcaff
Yes, that’s perfect.

Nicole Smith
Well, thank you everybody who is listening out there today. I hope you have a wonderful rest of your day and enjoy creating space and time freedom by now. Well, there we go. Thank you so much for joining me today. It’s been such a pleasure having you on board. Have we connected on social jazz? If not, please come on over. Say hi, I’m on all the platforms at the artisan solutions. So I’d really look forward to seeing you over there. And if you enjoy today’s episode, don’t forget to tag me and I’d love it if you could leave a review. And of course, share this with others so others can come and join us next time. All right, that everyone have a fabulous rest of the week and until next time, see you then.